Outside Erie

27 Responses to “Another Argument for Regional Government”

1. Jim
   March 31st, 2008 at 12:24 pm

   Turf wars continue? You are kidding. Right?

   As in any standoff, someone has to go first if there is to be meaningful change. What we have here is not so much a standoff, but more of a failure to engage.

   Those outside the city have gotten an unfair rap for years of being uncaring about the city condition, and have paid and continue to pay for the city fiscal irresponsibility. For example (one I’ve made many times) I live in Fairview, but work in Erie. So does my wife. Between the two of us, our EMS tax and the city retained portion of the wage tax, exceeds the .95 municipal property tax we pay to the township on our house. So I don’t need any lecture about parochial thinking. I am continually taxed, with no representation, by people with no fiscal responsibility.

   I pay considerably more for my water because west county agreed to buy water through Millcreek, from the city rather than petition the government for approval for our own take point to develop our own water system, only to see the current “regional” water authority, and Millcreek, both make money off my bill, while city council considers “forgiving” a loan from the water authority funded capital reserve fund, that they never had any intention of repaying. To a lessor extent the same could be said about sewer service.

   The county stepped up on the hotel tax, the bulk of which is used to retire debt on capital expenses that took place in the city limits, NOT to promote the county.

   While I don’t know the current numbers, for years Fairview residents exceeded the per capita average in the numbers of households with memberships to the zoo, then were urged to support tax payments from both the municipality and county to the “regional asset” owned and controlled by the city, with a lower per capita membership rate.

   I could go on and on, but the point is for years money has flowed from the surrounding municipalities into the city money pit, for which we have received little if any return on in terms of better services. No matter how much is provided, it is never enough. However, not matter what advise is offered to maximize the benefit, it is treated as has been the regional chamber attempts at airport oversight, and the county appointed prospective members to the authority.

   It is not a level playing field, nor two opposite but equal points of view in need of compromise here. It is a need to break the status quo of city expectations and behavior before simply pouring even more money down the drain.

   I demand more accountability from my township supervisors than city residents demand of their elected officials. Because of the amount of my money that is ending up in the city, in one way or another, I have the right to demand the same level of professionalism from them, and that is exactly what I am doing, and urging everyone else to do as well.

   You made the point that many city assets are used by those who live in the suburbs. True enough. But, we pay our way, plus! The city, who can’t pay their way, wants to dictate terms to those they expect to pay off their debt. Those days are ending. If that hurts peoples sensitivities, good enough. Maybe it will bring about long overdue change needed in the political mindset.

2. Danny Lucas
   March 31st, 2008 at 1:07 pm

   Erie provides you and your wife jobs.
   Fairview does not.

   To live in Fairview, a decent salary is required.
   You got it; compliments of an Erie CITY employer.

   Taxation without representation???
   Erie residents get the same taxation WITH representation.
   And, they stay in Erie.

   I have often wondered how eminent domain can take place by a government, on homes by the airport, or GAF on the Bayfront, but it does not work when a nearby government body exists.

   Maybe it is time for Erie to just annex Harborcrrek, Millcrrek, Wesleyville, Lawrence Park, Fairview, Girard,…oh hell, just do the whole county.

   When Edinboro was 1-1/2% local income tax, it was a crusher because many homes on the Lakeside area were owned by Pittsburgh residents, who came up in summer.
   Their wages tax went to Ambridge and happy towns like Mars.
   The University was off limits for taxation too.

   Fire protection was volunteer.
   Water is metered (and poisonous at times when the maintenance folks spill perchlorethylene into the well area and a new well has to be built……and that new one has high manganese content,….won’t kill you but has the peculiar habit of turning orange in color when soap comes in contact. That would be you, in your tub; your clothes in the washer; your dishes in the sink.
   NOT TO WORRY! The Boro would sell you little bitty bottles of manganese killer for a whopper of a price so you did not look like Halloween pumpkins in real life).

   BUT, 1-1/2% was not enough. The wage tax was raised to 2%. The only location in the county to grant that privilege is Edinboro. You need only RESIDE there to participate in the fun. You can work anywhere, as an Edinboro resident, and pay 1% local, but come April 15th, fess up the other 1%.
   It is just like matching a Social security tax, but you get to match BOTH sides yourself.

   Fairview does not have low taxes due to watching the supervisors. Fairview has the taxes it has, due to a disproportionate share of wealthy residents.

   By contrast, the city of Erie has its’ hassles due to a disproportionate share of poorer residents. It has nothing to do with this mismanagement philosophy bandied about constantly.

   Here is a tip Jim. Have Fairview stick a big pipe into the lake and get water for Fairview on your own. Pop back here and tell us how much less your bill for water (and sewer) becomes.

   Given the way you keep those township supervisors in line, I am in awe that they have yet to do their own water system. Get down there to the next meeting and fix that.

   Say, do you guys still have volunteer fire protection out there too? I suspect Erie Insurance may have to up your homeowner rates for lack of water, and, a professional person to employ it upon a burning home out there.
   Fix that too.

   And when the eminent domain brings us together, skip Edinboro. Bad taxes and Orange people do not look good on HDTV.
   Let Crawford County have the college and town.

3. Julio C. Reyes
   March 31st, 2008 at 1:28 pm

   Jim and Danny,

   We basically agree.

   I do agree with Jim that the water charges are a rip off for customers like him and should be stopped. I pay County property taxes in my city properties every year and I see that there is an unbelievable waste of resources in both ends. This little silly chiefdoms and kingdoms representing a medieval political and economic tribal system must stop.

   The only answer to avoid unnecessary waste is to consolidate services at much as possible. However, to do properly we must address these silly authorities, townships and City elected officials. All this looks to me like mob controlled territories.

   We have a problem in regards that while I definitively agree that the county must have representation for all the “regional” affairs. How do we control the size of the government and their monster children authorities? Do we really need eleven board members to change a Light bulb?

   In other posts I had mentioned many times that the unions are an animal in their own but in this case is even more critical how we convince them to work in a regional basis without throughing away the baby with the tub.

   I am not sure but I believe that the county also had many financial fiascos.

   My point is yes; eventually we will have a regional approach. The question is how we could control our government and make them accountable before we move forward. Please keep in mind that these guys are forcing us to fight each other (Jim vs. Julio; The City vs. the County) for their own benefit.

4. Ian Enterline
   March 31st, 2008 at 1:49 pm

   the annexation laws don’t allow for the City to do so…

5. Jim
   March 31st, 2008 at 1:59 pm

   What utter nonsense. Really!

   Thirty years ago the west county area explored the idea of getting our own take point, and establishing our own water system, to avoid the problems of dealing with Erie, and the number of different hands the water would have to pass through before reaching the end user. At the time then Mayor Tullio came out to Fairview, to the old Fairview High School (today it is the middle school) and held a west county town meeting and essentially begged us not to proceed, and promised to supply all the water we could use, at reasonable rates. He was concerned about the city losing take point authority, as they held a permit for taking far more gallons of water than they could possibly use, and this was when Hammermill, and other big industrial users were still operating. Fast forward a few years, and I was at a municipal government official legal luncheon, sitting at the same table with Mario Bagnoni and Jim Casey, listening to Bags sprout off about how the west county wanted Erie water, when the only reason we had it was because Tullio begged us to take it. When I pressed Bags on this issue, he said Tullio only speaks for himself, not the city. I’ve been living with that inconsistent approach to the city neighbors for thirty years and am tired of it. Tullio raped the water department for years. Everyone knows it, and that was the reason behind the formation of the current so called regional authority. It was supposed to prevent the misuse of water revenues. The public was promised that the city had learned its lesson, and that misuse of those types of revenue sources would not happen again. As part of the formation of the authority, a capital reserve fund was established with water revenue. Just last week, council considered renaming a loan default as “forgiving”, when they didn’t have the money to repay a loan they made from the capital reserve fund to make payroll. They lied, again, and now want to call a loan default forgiving, and the people in the city are buying this. So the city is still raping the water revenue. Even with an authority in place. I swear a portion of the Erie population are too stupid to be entrusted with the right to vote. Meanwhile, we are left with three authorities to pay, and the “regional” authority is regional in name only, and attempts to merge the Erie and Millcreek authorities have stalled for years. West county made a big mistake, and I admit it. We took Tullio at his word! I suspect the next payment the authority makes to the city will be spent just as wisely.

   And yes, Fairview does have a volunteer fire department. But for your information, fire insurance rates are determined by ISO ratings for Fairview residents, the same as they are for city residents. If you want a real eye opener start looking at what goes into an ISO rating, and comparing the differences between the city ratings and the surrounding municipalities. You might then wonder what all those dollars being spent in the city are actually buying beyond the political support Sinnott needed to get elected.

   I realize Erie has poor residents. But they also have Glenwood Hills, Frontier, South Shore Drive, Niagara Pier, and other upscale housing areas as well. What Erie didn’t have, until Filippi’s LERTA program was much in the way of new construction. It picked up dramatically, and is now threatened by council and the new mayor’s determination to reduce the stimulative effect of that program. It will be interesting to see in two or three years what has happened to the new construction rates within the city.

   I don’t keep those supervisors in line. Don’t have to. We elect competent people to begin with. During the last big snow storm, I talked to two of them, while they sat in the driver seat of a snow plow on my road. Come Sunday, with a little sun, we had wet pavement. Come Wednesday I had six inch ruts on the three city streets I have to travel to get to work. On Monday, we had trucking companies refuse to even attempt to reach our facility. On Tuesday we were contracting with a private company to plow city streets into our facility to get those same trucks rolling again.

   So if I understand your point correctly, your preference would be rather than to straighten out the city financial problems, annex Millcreek, and put the same fiscal controls running the city now, in charge of Millcreek. I guess its always easier to screw something else up than to fix something broken. But if you think that is an argument for Millcreek residents to support regionalism, or metro government, with the city calling the shots, then I’s like a shot of whatever you are drinking.

   As for your thought that all you problems are the result of simply too many poor people, I say denial is a wonderful thing. Especially in Erie. In Fairview we plan to spend what we have. In Erie you try to find the money to cover what you spent. There is a big difference in approach there. Until those approaches come closer together, it is not “parochial” to conclude that sending more county dollars to the city will produce any different results than has been the case for the past thirty years plus. With the current spend then tax mentality so prevalent in the city, no amount of money simply given to them with no strings attached will be enough. They will simply continue to outspend the available revenue as they always have. If I’m wrong about that, then why are the city politicians and appointed authority members so determined to maintain control, and prevent any meaningful outside advice from being instituted?

   I don’t see the airport fiasco as any different than the cash grabs by the convention center authority. Lou (whata guy) just wants what they got. Lots of money, no strings, no accountability. In one way, you can’t blame him. I guess that is how you define fairness. The other thing that gets lost in all this is why did the county opt out of the airport? Maybe you ought to do some real research there, because what is being said now is only a small part of the actually story. But then, no one really cares. Do they?

6. Julio C. Reyes
   March 31st, 2008 at 2:43 pm

   Jim,

   I really have to respond to your statements below:

   “I swear a portion of the Erie population are too stupid to be entrusted with the right to vote”.

   “I don’t keep those supervisors in line. Don’t have to. We elect competent people to begin with.”

   It seems contradictory to me that if your supervisors are competent and not too stupid like me in the City of Erie why they have not fixed the error after the county was fooled 30 years ago?

   The simple answer I guess is because it takes money, resources and hard work both political and social. At the end it really does not matter. I said in another post somewhere the two political parties already divided the cake and there is absolutely nothing you and I could do about it. Does Grant money (pork spending!) from Harrisburg and DC sound familiar?

   By the way, I do not vote because like you said I am too stupid to do so. But regardless how marvelous your supervisors are you might want to keep an eye on them to be sure you understand their willing and dealing and keep them honest. I happen to agree with Danny that poverty (an education as well) are a big factor both inside and outside the City.

   The way things are right now. Both parties are spending my great, great, great children future. Pease keep in mind that poverty is a government business. It generates customers for government assistance, and prisons and a good supply of able bodies for the Military.

7. Jim
   March 31st, 2008 at 3:31 pm

   Once we made the initial mistake of going with the city on water, and the build out took place, we no longer qualified for an approved “take point” to withdraw water from the lake, as the “need” was being met by the city system. Cost and service levels don’t enter in, because one government agency will also give benefit to another when competence is being addressed.

   My point is that an initial mistake is a fatal mistake in that once the horse is out of the barn, you can’t get it back.

   Many of these regional issues are one time decisions. There is no going back once they are made. SO if they are not done right the first time, the damage is not reversible.

   So lets not pretend that anything is going on here that is not. The city has no interest in regional government. If they did we wouldn’t have the continual problem of attempting to get a seat at the table in exchange for our resources. What the city wants is to expand their relm of influence, collect money from areas where they have no obligation of providing anything in return.

   You can call those who recognize the situation for what is it parochial, or whatever other name you want to call us, but it doesn’t change the facts. The city wants money without providing anything in return. Period.

8. Julio C. Reyes
   March 31st, 2008 at 3:58 pm

   Why eleven board members to change a light bulb? Because it is in the best interest of the politicians (everyone City, County, State and maybe even Feds)not the citizens to do so.
   .
   I believe a better option is one board member per district for a total of seven. Assigned by simple majority vote elections regardless of political party.

   In other words people from each district will elect their own representative for the Airport Authority in a free open especial election. Enforcing Term limits.

   The City of Erie already is ahead with a couple of districts so why two more board members and also why appointed. These appointments as I said many times preparing the willing and dealing. Kickbacks, paybacks, marriage contract and engagements between tribal elite, wherever.

   Who cares about the governor appointing people to the board just willing and dealing again that is crazy through history we have seen Harrisburg appointments that will make any decent person cry.

   Of course we will need the Harrisburg connections to get the bacon but I believe there are other ways …. This will be discussed some day in the future. I have to work.

9. Danny Lucas
   March 31st, 2008 at 5:55 pm

   I am getting “up to here” with my friends and relatives having surgery, me going to the hospital for them, and then coming back to find Global Erie has taken off to new heights once again! I need everyone to stay healthy while this gets straightened out!

   NOW, Jim, you are always welcome to share what I drink.
   Tho I abstain from alcohol, I drink an inordinate supply of truth serum daily. Surely it shows when I walk a straight line. It is on sale at Wegman’s; get a gallon.

   I have seen many things over the years, but I never saw “Bags sprouts”. Is that on YouTube?

   Ian says that the annexation law say “ix-nay on nex-annay”.
   Okay! (True Erie-ites speak Pig Latin). The Erie-Times failed to cover this event.

   Can the county annex the city?
   Can the annex law be amended?
   Will Sinnot be on Dancin With The Stars instead of Boxing with Bizarro? I dunno.

   But, Julio makes good sense when he advises the informed got duped, while Jim maintains they vote competence all the time out West. Jim, just stick a pipe in the lake NOW instead of stewing about 30 year old Lou Tullio recipes for success. I mean we could go back to the mayor of 1880 as well as Mayor of 1980 and it does zip in 2008.

   All those attornies and Hammermill executives out in Fairview can do it faster, than the Amish restored the town of Atlantic, in the dreaded tornado of 1985, that cause lines of weather reports ad nauseum on every tv moment since!

   And, I notice that everyone has backed off the Edinboro principle that if 1% income tax is good enough for every municipality in the county, let’s try 2% ala Edinboro.
   Do they still have orange underwear out there?

   The best way to get the water business and the airport business done is not to stack the deck with more committees. The authority was CREATED. It can also be DEFUNCT, KAPUT, OUT-OF-BUSINESS. Whoever CREATED had the authority to authority. Well then, it seems to me they have the authority to unauthority too. Voila!

   Mason Farms gets cheaper irrigation.
   Jim gets less irritation.
   Everyone has less authorization.
   And, if my relatives will stay out of surgery, I can give more presentation. See how things work out when there is cooperation in the nation?

   And Jim, straighten these two out to make sense:
   1)”I demand more accountability from my township supervisors than city residents demand of their elected officials.”
   2)” I don’t keep those supervisors in line.”
   Hello????

   Now, about those Bags sprouts…………..

10. George Vietze
    March 31st, 2008 at 7:38 pm

    Maybe I am too new here to know any better and maybe if I had the history of some of you old time Erie area residents I might not be so confident and positive. I believe what most of you think is interesting but unless this area is so totally different than the rest of the world, and it “might” be, most of those thoughts do not make the wheels turn. Money and political clout usually make the most movement. I believe Erie is reaching the critical mass where investments like the casino/racetrack and the political wishes of the State of Pa. to make Erie into a major hub will have the most effect on the future of Erie. The Airport is mandatory to the future growth of the area. Regionalization is a must, the old way has not worked for a very long time and the “cards” have been dealt. The Governor knows that he has a 5-7 year window before Ohio wakes up and legalizes gambling. The casino/racetrack located in Erie because it is within 500 miles of 50% of the population of the US (that does not even include Canada which is huge). Erie has beaches, 5000 hotel rooms, attractions to keep visitors here longer and full gaming is in the “cards” in the next 5-7 years. Most people don’t realize that 12% of the gambling revenue is set aside for racing purses which average over $400,000 per racing day, make Erie at par with the best tracks in the nation. This is attracting major farms and horses to this area. The horse business was dying in Pa. as it is now in Ohio. Ohio tracks are now for sale. Erie will be the Churchill Downs of Pa. The bottom line is that “juice” will grease all the wheels and things will happen. Too many people have too much money invested. The Airport is a given. When, is another question but with that “grease” it will happen a lot sooner than all the chatter. It is just like politics, there are no “grass roots” campaigns its all back room deals. Frankly, after I found out about the history of the area, I chose to buy land 15 minutes from the casino/race track, qualified under the “clean and green” ordinance, if land is more than 10 acres the taxes are low. 16-20 acres, on just the land ,is around $200 per year. Except for the Airport, the Erie area works pretty good for a lot of people, mostly older people who do not need employment. The area needs more employment to keep the young people and have a balance vibrant balanced community.
    Erie has more though, it has four great educational facilities, research centers, GE and other manufacturers, medical facilities, an art community, play houses, and the much under-utilized BAYFRONT, the GEM ON THE LAKE and don’t forget the LAKE…WATER…..The parent company of of GE Transportation, GE Energy has invested BILLIONS in engery and water industries. I believe they are looking at Erie…we are going to know in April. All that and I was led to believe before my son moved here that Erie was a small, old, run-down, mill-town going nowhere. I have done more marketing of Erie in the last couple of days than Erie has done in years and I am 71 years of age and it is all true…backed up by the Chamber of Commerce “fact” sheet and other facts. Leave the past where it belongs, in the past. I wish I had learned what I am going to tell you 40 years ago, some are going to believe this and some are not, it does not matter because if you don’t know it can not be explained to you.

    Thought manifest into matter, first you have to create the thoughts you want to manifest, second you have to focus on those thoughts to create whatever it is that you want to manifest or create, the third thing is the hardest and the easiest, you have to “let it go”, the spiritual usually call that “putting in into the hands of God” but the concept that you push and shove and run after it only pushes it out of reach. End of story.
    The train has left the station, as somebody said “miss it and miss out”.

11. Jim
    April 1st, 2008 at 6:36 am

    Danny you must know of know Bags very well. When discussing the city, and the divide between the administration and council, and the inconsistent approach by the two branches of Erie government towards their neighbors, he was certainly capable of sprouting. i often thought he would sprout wings and fly. At times I wished he would. It seemed his political life’s work was to undo anything Tullio attempted to do. If Lou said it was white, Bags said it was black. If Tullio changed his mind and said okay its black, Bags would argue it was green. Those who had to work with the city during those years never knew what to believe, other than you could bet in the end there would be no consensus, and it would be somebody else’s fault.

    To a large extent that mentality continues today. No matter what agreement is thought to be reached with the city, you can expect the goals posts to be moved before the deal is completed, at a minimum complicating the process, but more often than not ending it.

    The airport agreement difficulty is no different than the water authorities attempt to combine. And that is the point. At some point we need to see a meaningful change in the approach by the city, with examples of a common set of goals between the administration and council. Despite all the words here, that simply doesn’t exist today. I defy anyone to explain what Sinnott’s vision for the city, and it’s place in the region is, let alone what his plan for achieving that vision is.

    City council on the other hand, never has enough information to make a decision, therefore stall until most projects collapse under their own weight, then they search for someone to blame. Its happening again, with the airport, just as it has with so many other attempts at intergovernmental cooperation in the past. The common thread has remained the same, and continues to remain the same, and we continue to have a vast number of groups willing to either overlook the situation, or offer excuses, but in all cases urging the rest of the region to move forward, and understand the city has not, and will not change their approach.

    At some point, you would think that the message would get through that there should be some real change in approach, that at the very least puts the administration and council on the same page, with the same objectives in mind. That is not an unreasonable expectation on the part of county municipalities, and residents who are currently providing a significant amount of financial support to the city, and city assets already.

    I urge you to talk to council members, and really listen to their sense of entitlement when discussing regional issues. You will find they immediately put a price on even discussions. As for Sinnott, I am aware of several groups who have repeatedly attempted to get him to engage in meaningful discussion, only to be strung along for months before he decides he’s way to busy to even talk to them. Those two realities create a leadership vacuum that is sucking vitality out of the city, and transplanting in Millcreek, Summit, and other surrounding municipalities, which is simply creating more of a sense of entitlement with city council members.

    After decades of this the question has changed from what is the answer to is there an answer. That is an important point that is known but ignored. As I’ve said many times denial is a wonderful thing.

    There is absolutely no reason why the city cannot sit down, council and the mayor and come to the realization that they cannot make this airport project happen on their own. The should be no reason why they cannot also realize that to get help they need to give something in return, and that is a meaningful place at the table for those offering the help. Regardless of what you hear in the city conversations, that is NOT and unreasonable price to pay to move the entire region forward.

    Now some ask, why should the region demand inclusion in the decision making. Why not simply accept that the city knows best? Why shouldn’t the city demand a pay off in exchange for regional progress. I submit because it doesn’t foster a spirit of cooperation, and doesn’t produce results. I do agree that train has left the station. But it also left the tracks.

    Relatedly, in today’s paper is an article (page 4B) indicating that John Hornaman has said that the house local government committee plans to discuss the bill Senator Earll introduced to regionalize the airport. Hornaman said that the committee will be waiting for input from the Erie Regional Chamber and other stakeholders to see if any “tweaking” of the bill is required. So apparently the house is coming to recognize the necessity of providing a change in approach to this project, just like the senate did. Now I ask, what kind of message does that send to the rest of the state, and the governor, when it comes to requesting money for capital projects? Does it instill confidence in our ability to plan, institute, operate and maintain? How ’bout that? A federal project projecting an unfavorable image about the way we operate to state government.

    The point I’m making is that there is far more at risk here than just the airport. For years Erie has moaned about us not getting our “fair share” when compared to say Philadelphia or Pittsburgh. But lately, you hear Allentown, Hazeltown, Johnstown and others mentioned with the same concerns.

    As any AA attending drunk can tell you, you first got to realize you have a problem. We’re not there yet.

12. George Vietze
    April 1st, 2008 at 8:05 am

    Jim, you raise some very good points and you certainly have much more history and local knowledge about how this community has worked. The Governor and the State of Pa. are looking out for the entire State. As you are aware Erie has been behind the curve for many years, partly because of out-dated, old-fashioned and small thinking politics. Some other have even eluded to self serving and corrupt. I was not here and do not have a personal feel for that but I have been brought up around my part Italian background and chuckle when I heard your stories of Tullio and his counter-part. If one said “white” the other said “black”, that was why I left Boston and moved wesst to Arizona and California 50 years ago. This has created an opportunity for others who recognize that Erie was behind the curve but things are slowly changing.

    The State of Pa. has finally started to take control, the Governor is behind the move to get Erie “back on the tracks”, or else, they will put Erie back on track. Too much is at stake, not because they care so much about Erie, their interests are broader than that. Erie is vital to the economic interest of not only Erie but the entire State because Erie was chosen as the site for major gambling interests because it has access to beaches, tourists, Ohio, NY, Canada, and 50% of the population of the US, 5000 hotel rooms, Convention Center,
    Bayfront Development potential and WATER……

    There is no other major city with the potential that Erie has that has the availibility of affordable land within 15 minutes of downtown Erie. Most cities you have to go miles and miles and hours and hours to have horse farms close enough because the land has been used up for development and houses and the horse farms are forced further and further out of town. That will happen but not for many, many years. Plan for it folks because it is coming, the investments have been made and the political climate is demanding it. Comprehensive Planning could make Erie a greater City, let developers do what they want and the best ROI will prevail at the cost of quality of life. These discussions are helpful because it allows the “truth” to spead to the residents and can help shape the difference to a better community, but the money and the back-room interests will prevail.
    I my youger days, I have tilted some wind-mills, after awhile they get heavier and heavier, I know chose to live in the country and watch the show and although some people may think I move pretty good for someone my age, I know I am just having fun living in this area because even though I have not met anyone on this site yet, I can feel the “heart” and “spirit” and caring of some of the people who comment and frankly, thankful that this area has not developed any more than it has because it gave me an opportunity to live in a rural setting of peace, beauty and quiet yet only “minutes” instead of hours from the amenities of the City. This will change over time but it is important to maintain the beauty and country charm as it intergrates with growth and the progress that will come.
    It is already not bad and could only get better with proper planning.

13. Danny Lucas
    April 1st, 2008 at 8:08 am

    I defy anyone to explain what Sinnott’s vision for the city, and it’s place in the region is, let alone what his plan for achieving that vision is.
    —Jim

    The Mayor did it himself. In fact, he showed up here at Outside Erie, the first mayor on a blog as guest post in our era or area. This was new ground. Mayor blogs instead of gibberish with Cuneo and reinterpreted for you.

    And what did he get from the citizens in return?
    Read it yourself:

    http://www.globalerie.com/blog/2007/11/06/guest-post-a-new-era-of-government-cooperation/

    I note that a whopping 8 people responded, none of them named Jim. Your question at the top of my comment here should have been directed at the horse’s mouth.
    It was not done.

    In a county of 290,000 people, 8 chose to go online and talk to the mayor about HIS vision. If ever there was a time to directly influence a guy, that was it.

    You be the Mayor after this episode.
    Would you give much credibility to blogs?
    Would you think anyone is listening to what you say?
    Would you come back?
    It was embarrassing.

    Your portrait of Bags and Lou Tullio is accurate, tho not comprehensive. Lou started out a loser. In Erie politics, the primary is the election. If you win that, the election in November is sown up. Mike Cannavino beat Lou Tullio and the Tullio career was as over, as the Bagnoni career would be in the primaries to come.

    Cannavino made one mistake. He up and died 13 days before the November election. This was the biggest hanging chad in Erie history. The Kingmakers needed a new King. Otherwise, voters may make a mistake and actually vote.
    Enter Lou Tullio, a crippled candidate in May…and a Mayor in November.

    Lou ran the town like it was Chicago. He was supreme commander. He must have been good to dupe Fairview folks and yourself at a water meeting.

    I had many Lou moments personally and I suppose they should be left to rest. But my favorite public moment came when Willard Scott of the Today Show mentioned Lou and snow removal.
    It seems a city resident was upset that his road was not plowed and called Lou at home (yes, the Mayor was listed in the phone book for anyone to call on anything). The caller called at 3 am and screamed that his road was not yet plowed and it was 3 am.
    Lou said he would check it out and get back to Mr. Upset. He did.

    He had the streets boys get over to the man’s road before 3 am on the next snowfall (next day).

    Lou called the man to ask if the road was now satisfactory. The man was surprised, not at the road,….
    Lou called for the information at 3 am !!!
    Ya gotta love that in a politician.
    Now isn’t that better than the DiVecchio snow caper?

    By the way, the Erie Time-News failed to cover the Lou Snow Call event.

    Bags was known to SPOUT off. Little men have large voices. Better than swinging fists, in general.
    Bags sprouts was a knew one for me and I could not resist the joshin ya, Jim.

    Bags was a good man. He lacked one skill. Choose your battles wisely and you increase your odds of success. Bags, as you state, viewed every word from Tullio as a battle. This was not wise for it made Bags look like a sanctimonious, preening idiot when an egg fell on his face.

    I could tell 100 Lou stories but it would do no good. Lou died. Our town is doing the same but not from Amblyodosis (was that not odd to have the Mayor and the Governor succumb to the same rarest of diseases?).

    What you read on page 4b can safely be ignored. If Kevin Cuneo puts it that far back, it is filler not news.

    I met John Hornaman a coupla months ago and noticed the Christmas tree up at his office long after Christmas.
    I joked to him that if the tree was up this long, he should use a Mountain Laurel for his office
    His face went back and forth in nanoseconds from smile, to confusion, to the tree, to me, to ‘political correct?, to bewildered.

    I informed him that the State Flower was a Mountain Laurel. He walked out of the room (maybe to look up the State Flower). On the other hand, if you need some of the sharpest gals in politics I have ever seen, Rhonda up there on 38th Street will nail down any job you need done. This is one sharp cookie; she knows which battles to choose and which to lose. She would make a grand candidate one day. If she were a fish, she would be a “keeper”. Keep your eyes on her in the future.
    (She IS the rep now for all intents and purposes).

    Jane Earll is certainly more fun than Tracy Seyfert on her funniest day. Why don’t you invite Jane for a Reuben sandwich at the Oakwood and chat with her on your views Jim? Jane is a straight shooter. But, power in Harrisburg is diluted til unrecognized. We have too many Chiefs in Harrisburg and not enough Indians. Jane can introduce anything; so can 42,697 other folks. No one reads this stuff.

    Let me ask you Jim.
    Did it ever dawn on you that all of this talk, all of this posturing, all of this start and stop on the airport, has a reason other than nonaccomplishment of the accomplishable?
    This goofy runway came up when Tom Ridge was positioning (as Governor) for the top spot at the White House. 9/11 changed that and George tapped Tom to do his thinking. Tom brought us color coding and an Olympics in Utah, and the world relaxed. Tho “spider hole digging” futures went up on the stock exchange.

    I suspect that those days in the White House gave Tom vision that being Prez is NOT the job it is bragged up to be. You are a winner at election day; and a loser to someone every day after. Besides, Ridge now knows the true dirt going on. He made a clean escape and will go down in history as the color code man.

    Result? No Air Force one in Erie. Some cement contractor that wants to pour cement on 12th Street out there has no clout to get the public money, and the job has been in limbo since. He should at least learn the State Flower.

    The whole mess is a diversion for the people to take their eyes off the fact that our middle class life disappeared nationwide.
    We got rich; we got poor. We got middle class no more.
    And not just Erie, I mean the nation. The USA has a head and legs and nothing in between.

    Talking about golf courses and runways and water keeps the populace from realizing that their gutz were blown out.

    George Bush said there is “no way we are gonna let some cave dweller beat us, nosiree!”
    Bush leaves January 20th next year; he is already saying farewell somewhere now. He even granted 15 pardons to drug dealers last week (must need funds for the election in Novemeber), BUT, …he only commuted the sentence of another. Instead of a full pardon as we do for meth makers, this dastardly person deserved a mere commutation; it stays on their record. The crime was hideous. I do not know how the pardon people could bring it up. In all of recorded history, we have never allowed leniency for this type of behavior. But Bush did. I guess he is warming up to a Clinton-final-day-extravaganza of wasting taxpayer dollars to prosecute folks, and let em go scot fre on January 20th.

    The dastardly crime that got commuted instead of full pardon?

    Someone applied for food stamps and they were not qualified.

14. George Vietze
    April 1st, 2008 at 10:55 am

    Danny, you are great! This is a great history of the politics in Erie. Not sorry I missed that party. I was in Boston and if you think the politics in Erie were interesting follow the “Big Dig” and all the Boston fiascos. It is different yet its all the same. We all have been buried by these politicians one way or another.
    We can stay under the ruble or push it off and get up and move on. The middle class has been declassified, no question but some helped their own demise with loose credit on mortgages, credit cards, things and more things,bigger houses, bigger cars, bigger boats, purchased on money they did not have. Somebody made them do it. I know anytime I sign a mortgage for the biggest purchase in my life, “I read it?”. When the house goes up and they make THOUSANDS, they were smart, when the house goes down and they don’t want to pay for it, somebody make them do it. It is just human nature to blame someone else. The truth is we create our own life. No one else is to blame. Sorry, no one is listening anyway………..that is also, human nature….funny that we are human…..

15. Jim
    April 1st, 2008 at 10:58 am

    I knew Lou, as well as a county guy could, and worked (not sure with, for or against) on a number of projects were interests crossed, mostly relative to emergency services issues.

    I remember being in a meeting with him regarding fire department staffing reductions as a result of the formation of Emergycare, and I know what he said, and I also know what happened almost immediately thereafter, and it sure wasn’t what he said was going to happen. Point was he knew when he told us the story he was going to do something different. He knew it, we knew it, and he knew we knew it, and it didn’t matter, he sat there and told his story anyway. At the same time, several council members who also knew what was going on, became very vocal in their opinions, but never lifted a finger to actually do anything except run their mouths. As a result another opportunity to move things forward was lost, regarding some communications consolidation issues that are just now starting to be addressed decades later.

    I have been active in a number of different things since the 1960’s, and have watched what has worked and what hasn’t when it comes to getting projects moving. When you look at the failures there is a common thread that doesn’t take much effort to detect.

    I went back and re-read the blog with our esteemed mayor. I look at what was written there, and what the latest city/airport authority MOU contained, and note they are not the same, and I submit another example of moving goal posts that I referenced earlier.

    In talking about the gaming revenue situation, I was at several of the county council hearings on that issue, and testified at the first one, the same night as the mayor. I know what I said. I know what he said. And I know what retired Millcreek supervisor Paul Martin said, and Paul made a much stronger case for the city than did the mayor, who to be fair, was unable to get his time management skills working that night and ran out of time before he got to whatever his point might have been. In all due respect, that was the night for vision and leadership, not on a blog, and it fell way short of what the citizens of Erie should have expected, but probably didn’t.

    Those hearings, I believe, provided a great opportunity for county council people to hear what a vast number of, dare I say, special interests had in the way of expectations for a new revenue stream. They also provided an opportunity for the various municipal governments to get together on a comprehensive plan for utilizing a new and unknown resource. It was an opportunity lost, as there was essentially a disregard for the opinions of Summit, and others, by city controlled assets, which I believe might have started the divide that has resulted in the current law suit. The city position then, as best as I can determine from the shortened presentation, was that the city felt entitled to a percentage of the money equal to their percentage of county population, and in addition since most all of what they perceived to be regional assets were either located within the city, like the arts, or controlled by the city, like the zoo and airport, they felt they were the ones best suited to determine how and where the money should go. To a degree, I think the blog entry is consistent with that approach.

    Additionally, I think that most people agree that the library is a regional asset, whether or not one agrees that the county is the proper entity to run it. However, it was interesting to hear comments, and where they were coming from, opposing the use of any gaming money for operational expenses of the library, while at the same time urging exactly that for the zoo.

    As for the airport project, had the initial safety portion been done when and how Bob August wanted too, we wouldn’t be having this dialog now. But it wasn’t. He was fired, and Kelly was charged with changing the FAA’s mind on the second project’s addition 1,000 feet, which he never did. I don’t recall ever seeing media coverage of how all that came about, the mechanics of it. I think when Earll went out there and actually learned what had been going on, or not as the case may be, it opened some collective eyes. But it didn’t do anything to change the way decisions were being made, and apparently still hasn’t.

    I get to several statewide association meetings every year. Rest assured the rest of the state is well aware of what goes on up here, and do not hold us in the highest of esteem. However, they do know how to play us, which they do regularly.

    Its past time to change. Excuses aimed at convincing people to overlook the process problems don’t cut it anymore. It is time to make the necessary changes in approach within the city that leads to success in dealing with their neighbors, without attempting to charge for the privilege of just talking.

16. Danny Lucas
    April 1st, 2008 at 11:54 am

    George,
    “but some helped their own demise with loose credit on mortgages, credit cards, things and more things,bigger houses, bigger cars, bigger boats, purchased on money they did not have.”

    Not true. Our banks are like drug dealers. They hook you with a little, and addict you with a lot, until you are so far in, you cannot stop. For those who did try to stop via bankruptcy (largly a function of medical expenses unanticipated, job loss, or divorce), the rules were changed to make sure the middle class was deprived of Constitutional law……debtor protection.

    The new Bankruptcy law Bush passed gutted bankruptcy protection. It was written by the credit card folks. You ever read one of their statements on “your rights”? Try to opt out sometime and read the fine print that you can opt out, but they have the right to release your info “in the family” or outside the family”.
    Sounds like the Sopranos.

    The government raids Social Security Trust (we got two years max in there now); Wall Street is making terrible loan and financial decisions; credit cards and banks are charging fees for being over limit (why don’t they stop the transaction when you exceed??? cuz they make money by having you go over); changing payment dates and locations so that you can occur a late payment fee…even if you pay the whole mess off. It is a drug. Like the Casino.

    Jim,
    “I went back and re-read the blog with our esteemed mayor. I look at what was written there, and what the latest city/airport authority MOU contained, and note they are not the same, and I submit another example of moving goal posts that I referenced earlier.”

    The time to call out the Mayor on that, was when he read the blog and comments. Too late now. This is like voting after the election is over. Don’t count then.

    I agree with most of the rest of your premise Jim, on politics, Erie, what the state thinks of this corner (hell, Tom would not even locate state funds in local banks as governor; we should have had a whopper of state funds in “hometown” banks, (collecting fees) but they sat accruing fees in Philly and Pittsburgh instead…more votes there).

    Go to Bethlehem, PA and see the library (uh, maybe our library director could swing over). They are light years ahead of our operation. County support of Blasco declined in direct proportion to the closing of County Branches: Edinboro, Lawrence Park, West Erie Plaza, Millcreek Mall, whatever. Huge mistake too. The library is more central to our future growth than the zoo. That is another day.

    Your final paragraph Jim, shows a huge lack of trust by prior marriage to unfaithful spouses in political arenas. Now, you wanna divorce them for good.
    Divorce is expensive because it lures attornies too close when they smell blood. Pull back on that thought before blood is drawn and they smell it. These politicos are all we got to deal with.

    There is no master plan to our city, state, nation, citizens, churches, nothin!

    We run here and there kicking up dust and do nothing in the end. If we did do something, it would take into account none of the new ramifications of the action, and the net would get worse.

    What is the number one priority that MUST be accomplished before all others? Attack that.

    Then 2,3,4,5,6 to follow.

    No one agrees on what HAS to be done and in what order.
    Little wonder that we look like we are making great strides, while sitting and spinning in the ever deepening rut.

17. George Vietze
    April 1st, 2008 at 12:01 pm

    Jim, I really do admire your viewpoints and your tenacity and your integrity, I do not always agree with everything, but you have a lot of knowledge and what you say makes sense on most issues. I try to take a positive outlook because I see a great deal of potential in the Erie area.

    My experience has been with politics is that it does not matter what makes sense, what the ROI or anything that a logical, detailed, honest, caring person would consider before implementing plans. It is about special interests who contribute to campaigns, have business interests that directly or indirectly affect politicians or political agenda criteria or influences. Logic and community interest is way down on the list, thus your frustration.
    In my opinion, this will not change. It was interesting that on page 4b of todays newspaper they mentioned a new “master plan for the BAYFRONT” and they look forward to “community input”. The Master Plan is really needed but you can bet that it won’t be influenced by community input. Sorry. Think back….they told you one thing and their actions almost never matched what they told you. If it was not for the fact that the Govenor and the gambling money chose Erie for their gambling center and the racetrack to attract the horse business to satisfy the “tree huggers” it would be the same old Erie. The State of Pa. will run over the local politics like a train if they don’t get back on track. Maybe I am wrong, but frankly, I hope I am right because if Erie does what it has been doing for the last ______ years not much new would happen for a number of years.

    I will keep on watching and doing whatever little I can do to market Erie in a positive way, this is sure a learning experience. Never a dull moment….

18. Jim
    April 1st, 2008 at 12:49 pm

    Now that the racino is established and sending money to the state, I don’t believe the state, or the governor really care what we do with our share of the proceeds, as they got theirs. We can feel free to muck things up as much as we want in the revenue distribution, and the state will not care because they will continue to get their share.

    We also need to remember that Erie is only one of a number of gaming facilities that were authorized under the legislation. We had early importance due to being one of the early operations to start up, but as the others come on line, our importance and visibility will become proportionate to the percentage of overall revenue we generate for the state. That will be the same for the rest of the facilities as well. We would do well not to put a disproportionate amount of emphasis on that facility in comparison to the rest of them, thinking that it will somehow produce for us state furnished advantages that others might not receive. It won’t.

    Additionally, given the way the law is currently structured, the governor has relatively little input in anything other than how the proceeds get allocated, in so much as he can convince the legislature. The gaming commission runs the show, and are not under the control, at least not yet, of the governor, or the administration. Interesting, is that even before all facilities are operational, there are a couple of competing ideas on how to change the legislation, effecting how future decisions get made, and eliminating the need for as much consensus as is currently required. A classic power play. As northwest Pennsylvania has never been very good at power plays, we should watch. We might learn something.

19. George Vietze
    April 1st, 2008 at 2:50 pm

    Jim, I agree with most of what you said, except Erie has the best Racino in the State and it has the Bayfront and the beaches, no other location has what Erie has. This is not about caring about Erie but more about unless Erie can develop to its full potential with an adquate Airport and other support facilities such as hotels, beaches, bayfront development, restaurants that will maximize the gambling and revenue potentail in competing with Atlantic City and New York gaming facilities it will reduce the potential revenue for the entire State. There will always be power struggles as you mentioned and it would be helpful if Erie knew how to play that game. I am not very good at that game, but I did not chose that game either. Just an observation, I don’t have any crystal ball or special incite, it is just where I put my money and if it does not pass or come to be it still is good.
    Erie is the chosen City, you all wished for Erie to be chosen above other areas, be careful what you wish for, its coming.

20. Jim
    April 1st, 2008 at 3:58 pm

    I am waiting and watching regarding the impact the racino has relative to other venues in the region. I am not convinced that the majority of patrons to the racino will necessarily care about the other offerings we have within the community.

    I base that on the impact gaming had in other non traditional gaming areas when introduced. New Orleans for example found that gaming did little to increase tourism to the city, and gaming has struggled there, and I believe that they have had a change in operators at least once, maybe twice since opening. I also question how many patrons will be flying to Erie to gamble or attend horse racing, without the other benefits of say a Las Vegas. I suspect the airport will have very little to do with the success or failure of gaming in Erie.

    I have also seen conflicting reports as to the benefit to non gaming properties in Niagara Falls. Does gaming draw additional patrons to other non gaming venues in the Niagra region, or does the regional assets draw patrons to gaming? Or are they essentially separate audiences? One article I read seemed to indicate that a large percentage of the gaming customers were “day trippers” with little positive impact on non gaming properties. If that is true, I wonder what benefit other non gaming properties will see in Erie.
    For example what would the common attraction be between the racino and say Presque Isle or the Ridge Center or Waldameer? Is there any? What is the economic connection or combined impact. If you look at Seneca Allegheny an argument could be made that other non gaming properties are not necessary for gaming success.

    For an example, much has been written about the increase in revenue from the hotel tax proceeds, but nothing about the occupancy rates, and how much of the revenue increase is due to increased occupancy versus price increases. At one point the increased revenue percentages being presented, were equal to Kiplinger’s advise on the average increase in hospitality costs. That would indicate the increase could have been more a result of price increases than occupancy rates. Why is that relevant? Because prices increases is not real growth.

    In my opinion we need to keep our eyes on a multitude of economic balls, that are not necessarily connected. I sometimes fear we place far to much emphasis on whatever is the current interest, and neglect the rest until a problem arises, or a business closes or leaves or whatever shifts the community focus.

    Lost in all of this are cost of doing business issues, etc that effect all private sector operations. In the meanwhile, the increases to the cost of doing business through the subsidizing of public operations in competition with the private sector goes on, making those price increase all the more frequent. That price inflation concerns me as much in the service sector as it does in the manufacturing sector.

21. Danny Lucas
    April 1st, 2008 at 4:27 pm

    Why is that relevant? Because prices increases is not real growth.
    —-Jim

    Feel free to inform the oil companies of this tidbit.
    Bound to surprise the hell out of them.

    And the corollary?
    Price decrease is not real decline.
    That’s why low wages in China do not matter, eh?

22. Jim
    April 2nd, 2008 at 6:37 am

    Inflationary price increases are not growth because they do not increase the amount of goods or services being produced. They are not the result of increased productivity, and do not add to employment numbers, or even retention for that matter.

    This morning’s story on Steris should be an example. They are into another round of cost cutting personnel reductions, in spite of the so called savings realized from the Mexico move. As I’ve written numerous times before, productivity is the key, not labor rates, and this latest story is yet another example of what I mean.

    Real growth is an increase in demand for a good or service, regardless of the price, because of its value and quality.

23. Danny Lucas
    April 2nd, 2008 at 7:17 am

    Real growth is an increase in demand for a good or service, regardless of the price, because of its value and quality.
    —-Jim

    And the value and quality of Erie Hotel/Motel Industry, otherwise known as a service, has gone from the sole Best Western on I-90 for dancin and truckers, to Marriot, Splash Lagoon, soon Sheraton, you name it.

    There is a clear increase in that service sector locally. And THAT demand has driven prices; inflation is yet to come, after the truckers destroy the economy with a strike on oil prices. (Bush will be gone by the time damages set in).

    The increase on I-79 and I-90 corridor is backed up by Cafaro finally updating the Millcreek Mall. Note that Eastway Plaza and West Erie Plaza are not doing this; no demand. And, when Cafaro is done, do you expect rental rates to go up?
    Yup, more demand and better value.

    To attribute the tax coming into coffers solely to inflation is slim thinking when service is growing leaps and bounds.

    Casino needs sleeping places on site.
    Waste Management has filled the valley and made a mountain out of plastic diapers from my daughters. It seems a good time to cap it and make a golf course for the Casino people, staying at a hotel on site, to walk over for 19 holes before running back to deposit $4,000,000 a week into tax coffers.

    We really need to be building an annuity out of some part of these funds for a permanent capital base.
    Take 25% off the top and invest it in a local bank portfolio. NEVER touch the principal. It grows annually as additional 25% are added weekly.

    In one year, you have $52,000,000 in a permanent fund. And that will grow enormously over more time. But it yields funds for use in the form of annual interest.

    For easy compute, year one above at 10% wouild yield
    $5.2 million to spend. Too high for interest yields NOW; not in two years.
    Cut it in half. At 5% interest, you get $2.6 million to do zoo, library, airport, add some State Flowers to the Waste Management Golf Course, whatever.

    That $2.6 million is available every year forever.
    It increases by approximately the same amount next year due to continued addition to the principal.
    I can envision a day when the taxpayer gets a refund from the interest yields in the amount released, while keeping principal at work, grows exponentially.

    A chess board has 64 squares. Move a penny on square one. Double it to 2 cents on square 2; again to 4 cents on square 3, and 8 cents on square 4. By the time you get to square 64, it will make sense out of cents…..
    In fact, long before square 64.

    And, the goose lays gold every year.
    Right now, it is unknowingly and unaccountable spent with little sunshine or result.

24. anonymous
    April 2nd, 2008 at 9:40 am

    The banks are broke. All they want is the fee generating business without taking the risk of the commercial loans.

    Their commercial portfolio values are down at least 45%

    We challenge any local banker to dispute this on the blog.

    The Mayor asked the business community for advice on how to turn arounf this city and ignored us.

    We have read his plan. NOTHING has been implemented by the person at the sewer department who was had picked by the Mayor to implement the plan.

    Is there any wonder people are leaving this city.

    Who is going to pay off the bonds for the new convention center?

    What has the Chamber done to date to bring new businesses to Erie?

    Why are they so concerned about the GE shareholders coming to town?

    What is anyone DOING not WRITING ABOUT fixing this city?

25. Danny Lucas
    April 2nd, 2008 at 3:17 pm

    We challenge any local banker to dispute this on the blog.
    —–Challenge away; local bankers do not owe the time of day to an Anonymous. You want facts; lay some out on your end of the table.

    The banks are broke. All they want is the fee generating business without taking the risk of the commercial loans.
    —–Broke banks close doors. Hire a cab to take you to open banks. You will not have to drive far to find an open bank. Why? They ain’t broke.
    Your assertion is broke.
    Banks do NOT want the fee generation business OR the risk. As soon as credit cards and the like are booked, they are RESOLD just like your mortgages from bank to bank to bank.
    They make money on the shuffle game wholesale, not on pitiful fee sums as you state.
    Tell me you are not the State Treasurer!!!

    Their commercial portfolio values are down at least 45%
    —Link to facts somewhere. Pie in the sky statement; nothing more. And, who is “their”? Which bank?
    Which portfolio?
    Down 45% from what or when? 1863? 2002?? Monday???
    What a crap line to write.

    The Mayor asked the business community for advice on how to turn arounf this city and ignored us.

    —-Asking for advise is called “Wisdom”.
    Ignored who? Who is us? Poop statement again.

    We have read his plan. NOTHING has been implemented by the person at the sewer department who was had picked by the Mayor to implement the plan
    —–One Anonymous writer, but “We” have read his plan.
    Are you ok??? Only Ed Mead Mathews can use pronouns out of order. It is an Erie tradition.
    You are a banker above, and now you are in the city work department for you have INSIDE knowledge that NOTHING has been implemented. Prove it. What is the plan? You don’t know or you would state it, and what part is lacking?
    If a person was named, name em. They are certainly not on the payroll in Erie with a check printed to Anonymous.
    If you are making this bold charge, spill your guts on who and what. Or, exercise your right to remain silent.

    Is there any wonder people are leaving this city.
    —-Is there any wonder you don’t know where to use a question mark? People leave for myriad reasons; they also come here for myriad reasons. In fact, given the housing market nationally, Erie is doing pretty darn good in housing sales. Hint….a sale requires a buyer too.

    Who is going to pay off the bonds for the new convention center?
    —-My vote? Anyone who posts Anonymous should pay them off. Otherwise, taxpayers are ok.

    What has the Chamber done to date to bring new businesses to Erie?
    —–Nothing. Jim Dible needed a job after the Times canned him, er , I mean he retired. The important part is that Erie Times-News information and control has been extended to a new venue. Just yesterday, or was it today, Ed Mead Mathews wrote of the key gas prices in Ohio and PA and listed the price. His Deep Throat on this information of 10 cents a gallon spread (Ohio is cheaper) is Jim Dible and Mrs. D. They call up and tell Ed how much they paid for a fillup, and Ed prints the news that all of us need to know.
    (The part about PA having about 10 cents a gallon higher gas tax is conveniently omitted, but if you disagree with the apparent facts….take a mulligan. Write Kevin Cuneo on page 2A and he will “get it right” for you.
    Not the price of gas, but he will tell Ed we pay nore tax here in PA, thus Dible gets cheaper gas in Ohio, and things will settle down to normal again.

    Why are they so concerned about the GE shareholders coming to town?
    —–I do not believe that you wrote that sentence. It does not compute that a human being wrote this. I have read that there is no such thing as a stupid question, only the question that was never asked is stupid.

    You, Anonymous, have single handedly disproved that theory.

    What is anyone DOING not WRITING ABOUT fixing this city?
    —–Many are posing as Anonymous and WRITING that
    Doing not Writing About is the way to go.
    Too often, people just up and DO stuff without writing down a comprehensive plan. This leads to delay and error and rising costs.
    It includes such things as running schools, doing business as an airport authority, and shopping at Giant Eagle or Wegman’s.

    Keep that cholesterol high and you are gonna need Zetia Anonymous. Go to the Casino and pull one arm,
    and contribute to our tax base….voluntarily.

26. Julio C. Reyes
    April 2nd, 2008 at 3:25 pm

    Danny,

    As usual your presentation and argument about the capital investment is right in the money. I agree and I think I should have copyrighted that idea myself. I had presented that concept many times to several people around Erie. I have also used other public sponsored (Tax Breaks and subsidies, Grants, Subsidized Loans, Etc) business ventures to support my arguments (a new plant investment around the East side rings the bell? Imagine $200+ million in the bank under the same approach you describe. In a few years we will look like Alaskan Eskimos collecting a check from that fund every year for life.

    We do have a slight problem and I want your opinion about that

    Erie is just a little sinkhole in the Global Economy and unless we somehow protect that Capital we will back to square one. How will be protected from inflation, politicians and from scam artists you know Hedge Funds, Mutual funds, the stock market. Do we put the money on Gold, how we protect ourselves from the State and the Feds putting their hands in that money, do we invest the money in China, India, Union City, DC, The moon? Remember the Feds could print paper money at any time that will wipe out our Capital.

    Do we close the border with other States and municipalities after we create the nicest and wealthiest region (remember this was the original topic). If a local public figure put their hands in the money jar, do we give them the death penalty or we just kill the guys on welfare and food stamps.

    Any way I could go on and on but I really want to hear your ideas about protecting the Capital in a long term scenario. I have not figured that answer yet so any help is appreciated.

    What I have learn in my life time is that usually the biggest squeakiest wheel gets the Oil so from my perspective the only hope going back to the original topic (regional or not regional) is learn how to play the game and grow together as a region maybe then somebody will notice. Or at the very least we could scream together. As the things stand right now, the really big guys (DC and Harrisburg) I believe just laugh at us because we not only look pitiful taking recommendations from them (remember the Juice man) but totally dysfunctional as well.

27. George Vietze
    April 4th, 2008 at 7:15 am

    Erie Times News- RUNWAY BACK ON TRACK!

    The days of Erie not getting support from Harrisburg are in the past. That may have been true before the State of Pa. and the gambling interest chose Erie for the states premier casino/racetrack. Erie is the chosen location.
    Evidence is all around us and we are slow to catch on.
    Millions available for the Tullio Center, new convention center, new master-plan for Bayfront…etc.,etc.,

    “Federal and State agencies are on board for Erie International Airports planned $80.5 million runway expansion project.” “In fact officials of those agencies have even SWEETENED the funding deal for the project.”

    “Erie County Executive Mark DiVecchio, Erie May Joseph Sinnott and Porreca led a local delegation to HARRISBURG
    to discuss final project funding with the representatives of the FAA and State Bureau of Aviation.”

    “Porreco said the meeting with the FAA officials could not have gone better.” “It went extrordinarily well, “said Porreco, “We could not have asked for anything more than we received today.”

    “Porreco said the FAA agreed to take $14 million from 2013 and provide that in 2008. The FAA also agreed to provide matching funds AT A HIGHER RATE.” (AMAZING!!!)

    “Meanwhile the state Bureau of Aviation increased its contribution. The airport expected the state to chip in about $12 million. But NOW, Porreco said, the state has upped its contribution to $5.7 million.” (ASTOUNDING!!)

    “THE COMBINATION OF ALL THOSE THINGS APPEARS TO HAVE ELIMINATED ANY FUNDING SHORTFALL.” Porreco said.(WHAT?!!!)

    “The construction plans call for adding 920 feet to meet safety requirements in 2010, rehabilitating the existing runway in 2011 and adding an extra 1,000 feet to increase the airports capacity in 2012. Final wrap-up work would be in 2013.”

    “CHAMBER ENDORSES REGIONALIZATION” “BOARD MEMBERS OF THE ERCGP VOTED TO SUPPORT EARLL’S SENATE BILL 1051 AT A MEETING TODAY.”

    Maybe after all these years of no response from Harrisburg this group in one meeting have improved their negotiating skills, or just maybe this fits into the Govenors 5-7 year windoow before Ohio decides to GAMBLE.
    Pennsylvania has gotten a taste of the MONEY and wants to gain the advantage and Erie is a key location being on the water with beaches, convention center, racetrack,
    5,000 hotel rooms, access to 50% of the population of the US and across the street from Canada.

    For a place that has been burdened for years with the lack of support from the State, as you have written, I was not here, but take your word for it, the handwriting is NOW on the wall. LOOK AT THE WALL….don’t fight it…those who want this prosperity rejoice…those that are NIMBY (Not in my back yard)at least MASTER PLAN for guality growth. ENJOY…..